awakeningtothedream.com Forum Index awakeningtothedream.com
Non Duality: The one question to all our answers.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

"What I Am"
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    awakeningtothedream.com Forum Index -> Awakening to the Dream
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
godindrag



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 38
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:45 pm    Post subject: "What I Am" Reply with quote

Hi,
Hope publicizing meetings is ok here - There's also an article and weblink to stimulate / paralyse you Wink
Thanks,
gid

"What I am" by Unmani

What I am is Life itself. I am not this appearance of a separate individual. I am not this image of a body. I am not this label or thought. But in fact all of this is happening in what I am. I am not in this body. The body is simply an image appearing within what I am. I am absolute nothingness. Paradoxically, I am absolute everything. Everything is simply nothing appearing as everything. This is what I am. Language is limited and can never truly express this. However, all that appears: every word, every image, thought, emotion, physical sensation, is happening in Life itself. This not special, this is not owned by any particular special enlightened people. This is most ordinary.

In this play of Life there is the play of searching for fulfilment or enlightenment. There seems to be a path towards reaching this goal. There seem to be things that ‘I’ can ‘do’ in order to get closer to enlightenment. These things seem to provide a certain relief for a while but then the pain of separation seems to return. This game of seeking is played out until it is seen that any relief is simply temporary. Replacing one state with another is found to be totally unsatisfactory. Any idea of hope is seen through. The play of Life is seen as it is.

What I am is beyond all states. What I am is before, during and after any state. What I am is timeless. What I am is hopelessness. What I am is enlightenment. What I am is too simple for this long word ‘enlightenment’. What I am simply is.

This can not be understood. This can not be worked out. This can not be ‘got’. This can not be thought of. This can not be gained or lost. This can not be experienced. But somehow this is already known beyond all experience. This is the nature of what I am. This, right now, is the enlightenment which is sought, and this is the enlightenment which can never be found.

no gosannyasnews.com/Articles/Unmani.html

Unmani holds meetings in Hampstead, North London.
Details of her recent book and her venue can be found on her website at
no gonot-knowing.com


Meetings are on Saturday afternoons, 2-5.30pm (with a tea break).
And Friday evenings, 7-9.30pm.
All meetings are now held in the library at the
Philadelphia Association,
4 Marty's Yard,
17 Hampstead High Street,
LONDON NW3 1QW
2 minute walk from Hampstead tube station.
Cost: £10 (Payable at the door). Booking essential as spaces are limited.
There may be more meetings on Thursday evenings in Highgate, so please check the website regularly for dates.
BOOKING
It is essential to book in advance. Please phone Unmani on 020 8961 8471 or 0774 8531601.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gid, nice to see you 'here'. Very Happy

"There is no belief here that there is any one 'out there'...not even you... or me!"

And yet, it is 'known' that these words are read from the perspective of every person who seems to read them... including 'you' and 'me'.

'you' and 'me' are 'composed' of the same no 'thing': sensations and meaning. In the momentary conjunction of colours, odours, sounds, flavours, feelings and meaning... we appear.

All meaning is self-referential... all meaning as one. In knowing one thing all things are known.

What is 'meaning' and what is 'sensation'... 'self evident'.

Who am I who reads these words and knows their meaning?

Neither godindrag nor michael...

Unseen/seeing/colours
Unheard/hearing/sounds
Unsmelled/smelling/odours
Untasted/tasting/flavours
Unfelt/feeling/feelings
Unknown/knowing/meaning

Cool Laughing

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Uh oh Embarassed
HELP!!! Another horrible haiku is arising in what you are:


'hiya' godindrag!
What I am is what you are
therefore... we are one.



You are absolutely everything..... including this haiku hopelessness! Rolling Eyes Wink

Wonderful website, by the way! Very Happy

This is exquisite:

"In what I am there is no box. There is no safety. Everything is exposed. There is no definable box of a character. Anything can happen. Sitting with eyes closed can happen or bursting into tears can happen. Nothing is more significant than anything else. There is simply what happens. There are no rules. There are no limits." Unmani

and this:

"This is not going anywhere. This is the beginning and the end. This is it. There is nothing more or less. This is the whole of Life and Death. There is no journey. This is it. There is nowhere else. This has always been it. There never has been a past and will never be a future. This is all that has ever been longed for. This is it." Unmani

WOWEE!!!

love,
sara
_________________
There is only Love
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
heron
Guest





PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 11:47 am    Post subject: Re: "What I Am" Reply with quote

godindrag wrote:
Hi,
Hope publicizing meetings is ok here - There's also an article and weblink to stimulate / paralyse you Wink
Thanks,
gid

"What I am" by Unmani

What I am is Life itself. I am not this appearance of a separate individual. I am not this image of a body. I am not this label or thought. But in fact all of this is happening in what I am. I am not in this body. The body is simply an image appearing within what I am. I am absolute nothingness. Paradoxically, I am absolute everything. Everything is simply nothing appearing as everything. This is what I am. Language is limited and can never truly express this. However, all that appears: every word, every image, thought, emotion, physical sensation, is happening in Life itself. This not special, this is not owned by any particular special enlightened people. This is most ordinary.

In this play of Life there is the play of searching for fulfilment or enlightenment. There seems to be a path towards reaching this goal. There seem to be things that ‘I’ can ‘do’ in order to get closer to enlightenment. These things seem to provide a certain relief for a while but then the pain of separation seems to return. This game of seeking is played out until it is seen that any relief is simply temporary. Replacing one state with another is found to be totally unsatisfactory. Any idea of hope is seen through. The play of Life is seen as it is.

What I am is beyond all states. What I am is before, during and after any state. What I am is timeless. What I am is hopelessness. What I am is enlightenment. What I am is too simple for this long word ‘enlightenment’. What I am simply is.

This can not be understood. This can not be worked out. This can not be ‘got’. This can not be thought of. This can not be gained or lost. This can not be experienced. But somehow this is already known beyond all experience. This is the nature of what I am. This, right now, is the enlightenment which is sought, and this is the enlightenment which can never be found.

no gosannyasnews.com/Articles/Unmani.html

Unmani holds meetings in Hampstead, North London.
Details of her recent book and her venue can be found on her website at
no gonot-knowing.com


Meetings are on Saturday afternoons, 2-5.30pm (with a tea break).
And Friday evenings, 7-9.30pm.
All meetings are now held in the library at the
Philadelphia Association,
4 Marty's Yard,
17 Hampstead High Street,
LONDON NW3 1QW
2 minute walk from Hampstead tube station.
Cost: £10 (Payable at the door). Booking essential as spaces are limited.
There may be more meetings on Thursday evenings in Highgate, so please check the website regularly for dates.
BOOKING
It is essential to book in advance. Please phone Unmani on 020 8961 8471 or 0774 8531601.


Hi Unmani

Long time no see since meeting at one of Tony's. Maybe come to one of your meetings next time I am up at Richards.

"This game of seeking is played out until it is seen that any relief is simply temporary"

...........also it is not necessary to see that?........or seeking to cease?
Back to top
godindrag



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 38
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Michael,
You remember me, do you? Wink What a long sticky memory happening in timelessness and absence...

Quote:
"There is no belief here that there is any one 'out there'...not even you... or me!"


There is an assumption that there is someone out there and someone here. (and that there is an 'out there' and a 'here')
These are reasonable assumptions.
These assumptions/beliefs are thoughts happening in nothing - in 'no out there no here no someone'...

Quote:
And yet, it is 'known' that these words are read from the perspective of every person who seems to read them... including 'you' and 'me'


That's a reasonable assumption.

No need for any belief in 'other perspectives' or 'no other perspectives', and no need for the absence of such beliefs.

Without the belief in other perspectives or in no other perspectives, how many perspectives are there?

Just this.
... which is not a perspective as a perspective is defined as such by the existence of another perspective.

Quote:
All meaning is self-referential... all meaning as one. In knowing one thing all things are known.


By 'knowing' you mean 'understanding meaning' rather than direct cognizing?

I'm not that interested in meaning.. Don't know what it means actually Wink

There is understanding and interpreting of experience in terms of there being other perspectives, other times, other places etc.

Never found any other perspectives, other times, other places though... so the belief in their existence is simply a belief, as would be the belief in their nonexistence.

I find that trying to make beliefs into something more substantial - while seemingly providing security - actually seems to go along with restriction of the breathing and low to mid level panic as well as a feeling of being a fake and a coward Laughing

I don't know anything. Total insecurity. How relaxing Smile

Big Cuddly Hugz,
gid.

btw In case anyone thought I was advertising myself, I'm not Unmani! I'm a friend and fan of her expression - come to the meetings you Brits!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gid. Of course I remember you.

And rememvering you, is no different to re-membering any 'thing'.

'You' are simply meaning presently arising in awareness, associated with a few marks on a coloured background which are remembered (meaning) as 'words on a computer screen'. Shocked

There are no 'words' nor 'computer screen'... just coloured patterns.

And yes, there is 'no out there' as opposed to 'here'.

There is only 'here and now'.

Witnessing only colours, sounds, tastes, odours and feelings and believing that 'here and now' is defined solely by their rise and fall (each apparent moment) is very short sighted indeed.

(There really are no 'moments') Very Happy

This that is, is infinitely more than these fleeting sensations.

This that 'is', 'knows' as well as 'senses'.

What is known, is 'meaning'... 'self evident'.

What is the nature of this 'knowing/meaning'... no idea Very Happy

Assumptions/beliefs are just part of meaning... they have no independent reality... including godindrag. 'He' doesn't exist... and nor does 'michael' or 'sara' or maple3', or Umani, or...

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

godindrag wrote:
There is understanding and interpreting of experience in terms of there being other perspectives, other times, other places etc.

Never found any other perspectives, other times, other places though... so the belief in their existence is simply a belief, as would be the belief in their nonexistence.


Of course 'godindrag' cannot find any other 'perspective'... 'godindrag' is the perspective Very Happy

It is all belief... even the belief that there is 'interpreting of existence'.

No 'thing' appears that is not 'known'.

It is 'self evident' that all 'things' known are 'inter-dependent'... which is to say all meaning is 'self referential'. In knowing one thing, all things are known... though not all are remembered in awareness in the apparent moment... again 'self evident'. Very Happy

It is in knowing, remembering and forgetting that the illusion appears...

While these words are read for meaning... that to which they point remains seemingly hidden behind the concepts. Cool

Here nothing changes at all except these fleeting sensations. Very Happy

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
godindrag



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 38
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Of course 'godindrag' cannot find any other 'perspective'... 'godindrag' is the perspective


So I guess it's not 'known' - in any perspective that there are other perspectives - it's just believed.


Quote:
It is all belief... even the belief that there is 'interpreting of existence'.


...Or that there is any 'self-referential meaning ' or 'Elf-heifer bench hall screening...' Twisted Evil Laughing Laughing


Quote:
It is 'self evident' that all 'things' known are 'inter-dependent'... which is to say all meaning is 'self referential'. In knowing one thing, all things are known... though not all are remembered in awareness in the apparent moment... again 'self evident'.


What a lovely story Wink Does it keep you warm at night? Twisted Evil
Feels a bit smothery and sticky for my taste though, think I'll retire.... I sleep alone Rolling Eyes

A big hug and a playful pinch 2 U! Razz
gid
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 5189
Location: There are no locations

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="godindrag"]
Quote:
Of course 'godindrag' cannot find any other 'perspective'... 'godindrag' is the perspective


So I guess it's not 'known' - in any perspective that there are other perspectives - it's just believed.


Quote:
It is all belief... even the belief that there is 'interpreting of existence'.


...Or that there is any 'self-referential meaning ' or 'Elf-heifer bench hall screening...' :twisted: :lol: :lol:


Quote:
It is 'self evident' that all 'things' known are 'inter-dependent'... which is to say all meaning is 'self referential'. In knowing one thing, all things are known... though not all are remembered in awareness in the apparent moment... again 'self evident'.


What a lovely story ;-) Does it keep you warm at night? :twisted:
Feels a bit smothery and sticky for my taste though, think I'll retire.... I sleep alone :roll:







We all sleep alone.



toombaru
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like a good idea Very Happy

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

godindrag wrote:
Quote:
It is 'self evident' that all 'things' known are 'inter-dependent'... which is to say all meaning is 'self referential'. In knowing one thing, all things are known... though not all are remembered in awareness in the apparent moment... again 'self evident'.


What a lovely story Wink Does it keep you warm at night? Twisted Evil
Feels a bit smothery and sticky for my taste though, think I'll retire.... I sleep alone Rolling Eyes

A big hug and a playful pinch 2 U! Razz
gid


Of course it's a story... what else do you expect to find here.

Most stories just tell stories. A few stories point to that which knows all stories.

Some words point to the experience ('mother', 'freedom', 'planet', 'fuck'), a few (seeing/colour, knowing/meaning) to that which 'knows' the experience... inseparable these two appear: experience and experiencing.

And yet the experience appears to change... the 'experiencing does not'.

But this is just another story while so ever it is understood Wink

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The words 'seeing/colour', 'hearing/sound', 'feeling/feeling', 'smelling/odour', 'tasting/flavour' and 'knowing/meaning' are 'joined' as it is impossible to separate the 'sense' (seeing) from the 'sensation' that is sensed (colour), or the 'knowing' from the 'meaning'.

Only 'colour' is seen. Impossible to see seeing, yet in seeing colour, 'seeing' is 'self evident'... it requires no proof Very Happy

'Self evident' that colours appear to change... seeing does not.

While each sense is 'self evident', 'Knowing' cannot be seen, or heared, or tasted, or smelled, or felt. To the senses it appears as 'non-existent'.

Yet 'knowing' is known in the same way seeing is seen: in knowing meaning, 'knowing' is 'self evident'... it requires no proof.

While so ever the apparent focus is on understanding the meaning of these words, the 'knowing/meaning' they point to is missed Evil or Very Mad Crying or Very sad

'Knowing Thyself' has nothing to do with analysis.

Love
_________________
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
godindrag



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 38
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Helloo!
Holding life together with meaning and belief - in other perspectives, self referential meaning, remembering and forgetting, (i.e. time) is a bit of a strain, I find.
If you just shut up and sit there, the sky doesn't fall, I find.

Figuring it all out and telling stories to show (yourself) how much you've figured out feels a bit 'weary, stale, flat, unprofitable etc.' feels a bit arrogant - (arrogance is just self-doubt in deep denial) Feels a bit desparate...

- and indeed, what else could be found here but stories....

I've found it very unsatisfactory to try to 'own' understanding of all this stuff.
I don't own anything. I don't know anything . I don't understand anything.
I'm completely lost.

It's not 'all belief'. It's all actuality. The actuality of belief is energy appearing as thought. That's a story. I don't know that either.

That's the 'spirit' of what I'm trying to say, but if you concentrate on the words, you won't hear that, I guess.

So that doesn't leave much to write about really... you might as well go back to weaving webs of meaning... The sky won't fall either way Smile

Lurve,
gid
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

godindrag, you are so funny and fun!!!

my favourite bits, brackets mine:

godindrag wrote:

gid: Holding life together with meaning and belief....[Shocked]

......[WOW...really gerringeee]


gid: If you just shut up and sit there, the sky doesn't fall, I find.

......[YES IT DOES!!!!]


gid: I've found it very unsatisfactory to try to 'own' understanding of all this stuff.

......[I've found it very hard NOT to own it! Wink ]


gid: I don't own anything. I don't know anything . I don't understand anything.
I'm completely lost.

.....[yeah, really clomps......? there seems to be a smugness with that? Razz ]


gid: It's not 'all belief'. It's all actuality. The actuality of belief is energy appearing as thought. That's a story. I don't know that either.

.....[...energy appearing as thought...GORGEOUS!!!Exclamation ]

gid: That's the 'spirit' of what I'm trying to say, but if you concentrate on the words, you won't hear that, I guess.

......[The spirit feeling here is: I want to hold you in my arms for all eternity! Let the sky envelop us with all those beautiful swirling colours!!!!


love,
saramelding
_________________
There is only Love
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
godindrag



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 38
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
godindrag, you are so funny and fun!!!


Yes. I do believe I am Smile


Quote:
gid: I don't own anything. I don't know anything . I don't understand anything.
I'm completely lost.

.....[yeah, really clomps......? there seems to be a smugness with that? ]



Aw Sad , nope, no smugness... tastes too much like vomit in my experience.... Ok I don't even know that I don't know? Not knowing is absolute knowing?, oh fuck it! Just read Unmani's book!

Laughing

Quote:
......[The spirit feeling here is: I want to hold you in my arms for all eternity! Let the sky envelop us with all those beautiful swirling colours!!!!


You saucy liitle minx! Wink

*adjusts his panties*
gid
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    awakeningtothedream.com Forum Index -> Awakening to the Dream All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group