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Awareness has I Am
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nemo



Joined: 28 Nov 2005
Posts: 213
Location: NorCal

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:38 pm    Post subject: Awareness has I Am Reply with quote

Pondering where/why the sense of volition and choice come from, if there is no separate individual here to choose or act. If there is no "me" to choose or act, why is there still a sense of choosing?

The thought that occurred is that awareness itself (or consciousness?) carries with it the sense “ I Am”. That a fundamental aspect of awareness is the sense I am.
So, when awareness appears or manifests as action, then there is a sense of I Am Doing.
When seeing happens there is the sense I am Seeing.
Knowing: I am Knowing
This does not mean there is someone here doing, seeing , knowing, yet all seem to arise and occur, and with it the sense I Am
So, perhaps I Am ness is a quality to/of maniifestation and existence
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sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nemo wrote:
So, there is only experiences (italics mine), unlinked and unmeaning

The experience is aware

There is awareness AS the experience



O.k., these words make no 'sense' here, but, perhaps for that very 'reason', they seem to be hitting me over the head 'like a ton a bricks' and 'thoughts' shut down and THAT that is likes it, in fact it gets giddily euphoric every time it is seen! Surprised Question Laughing And it's also so natural and obvious, 'cause that 'experience' stuff seems that way here, too.

But it's still crazily fluid, swishing in and out, back and forth like my washing machine, making me dizzy and upsetting my stomache!

Experiencing is just happening. It's very sensual and it's changing all the time, every minute of the day AND night. This is not exactly new and definitely not scary, but it's (always) different! And it's excellent! Go figure! Very Happy


nemo wrote:
I would say there is only an experience, and a story called leo (or sara, or nemo). Currently there is a reluctance to use "I" or to say "i am ....anything (or nothing)"
joe


AND NOW:

nemo wrote:
Pondering where/why the sense of volition and choice come from, if there is no separate individual here to choose or act. If there is no "me" to choose or act, why is there still a sense of choosing?

The thought that occurred is that awareness itself (or consciousness?) carries with it the sense “ I Am”. That a fundamental aspect of awareness is the sense I am.
So, when awareness appears or manifests as action, then there is a sense of I Am Doing.
When seeing happens there is the sense I am Seeing.
Knowing: I am Knowing
This does not mean there is someone here doing, seeing , knowing, yet all seem to arise and occur, and with it the sense I Am
So, perhaps I Am ness is a quality to/of maniifestation and existence


Question See how everything seems to keep changing?

So now, the sense "I am" = "awareness as the experience" or just "experiencing"? Not really asking as much as just .....experiencing .....Oh, great Rolling Eyes It's freezing cold out and I gotta go walk on the beach again!

love,
sarastop Exclamation
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nemo



Joined: 28 Nov 2005
Posts: 213
Location: NorCal

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Ms. Sara,

Well , I think that the words making no sense yet having big impact is a good sign Very Happy
If a pointer is able to shut down the mind, just make the bearings seize this is a goodness, IMHO.

As for the contradiction, there is still no "I" in the sense of a single being. There si still just the experience.
The "awareness as I" seems to address the sense of I ness or identity.
And, even reading what was just written I have no idea what I am talking about - the words make no sense. Agreed. At some point the meaning just seems to drain away and all are left are squiggles. Perhaps the squiggles mean something to someone, or acts as powerful pointer for others. Or a whetstone to sharpen against for others.
Or meaningless gibberish for others.
It was just a thought or insight or realization that came this morning that seemed a good pointer, seemed to fit.
There is no claim to being right or true or real or consistent.
Trying to talk about this stuff is like trying to fit an elephant into a mouse suit. I won't go so far as to say a "useless" exercise, though I get that aspect.
Wink
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sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nothing really matters! Wink

It's enough that these squiggles mean something to THIS. Cool

AND Exclamation there is also a very deep resonance here with the "sense 'I am' ness" post.

Funny isn't it how all of this happens, and what sets it off......so simple and casual and with a sense of "why isn't this always seen" Question It's soooooo "DUH"!!!! Laughing And yet ......

Beach is too cold. So maybe exercise, breathing and meditation and/or whatever else presents itself might help with the 'integration'.

love,
saraware Idea
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michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sara wrote:
Beach is too cold. So maybe exercise, breathing and meditation and/or whatever else presents itself might help with the 'integration'.


Sorry, my love... nothing doesn't even 'help' with integration... it IS (integrated).

When it comes to integration, every 'thing' (meditation, breathing, going for walks, particpating in forums) is all 'useless' Wink

But you do meet some nice people here.

Love
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awakening
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Joined: 12 Nov 2005
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:55 am    Post subject: Re: Awareness has I Am Reply with quote

nemo wrote:
Pondering where/why the sense of volition and choice come from

The sense of volition and choice both 'come' from the same place where the pondering comes from... Nowhere... Now-here. Very Happy

It reminds me of a joke in news letter number 54

A Solution For Everything

A psychiatrist is interviewing a patient, who beliefs he has a solution for everything.

At some point the psychiatrist says to the man "Imagine there is a hungry tiger with you in this room. The door is locked and you can't get out. What would you do?"

The man answers; "I would blast him to kingdom come with a Kalashnikov automatic rifle."

"Aha," says the psychiatrist triumphantly, "I told you that the door was locked, so where would you get that rifle from?"

Without hesitation the man answers;
"Same place you got the tiger."

----------------------------------------

And by the way, the new news letteris on line at:
no goawakeningtothedream.com/

***********
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nemo



Joined: 28 Nov 2005
Posts: 213
Location: NorCal

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes, leo , of course, that is the non-answer to all questions.

yet pondering arose and led to the observation of identity and I ness arising in/as/of awareness

Perhaps it is this identity that has a chair being known as a chair and not an aardvark (or whatever).
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awakening
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Joined: 12 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nemo wrote:

Perhaps it is this identity that has a chair being known as a chair and not an aardvark (or whatever).


That explains why my chair moves out of the way every time I try to sit on it.
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nemo



Joined: 28 Nov 2005
Posts: 213
Location: NorCal

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does It? That sounds inconvenient. Maybe a beanbag chair would work better for you. or a series of pillows.
Wait...you live in Amsterdam, right, that explains alot. LOL
I'm just funning with you.

I once postualted that "inanimate" objects move when they think we're not looking. Which explains why drunks and tripsters see moving things - the objects know that thoose reporting the movement won't being taken seriously.

And, on another level, why would a chair mind being sat upon? Part of its identity, its "purpose" is that of being sat upon. That being said, I *have* heard a few groan as a huge friend sat down on it. Wink

I know I'm violating all kinds of ND rules here and the ND police will call for my immediate arrest and seizure, forfiture of all non-property not owned by no-one, in no-time flat, but for the rest I trust we can play with and translate appropriately. Rolling Eyes
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fox



Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 821
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Nothing really matters!


oh, there is something that actually DOES matter - but it is a secret!



Cool
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sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Laughing

aehhhmmm....deja vu all over again Wink :


fox wrote:

"however...

there is something that is actually NOT part of the dream!!"

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sara gasped:

"Huh?"

"Oh, dear fox! DO tell!", she begged.

"...there is something that is actually NOT part of the dream!!..." Question


and fox replied:

"aehhmm, it is still a secret...! Cool"
.
.
.
.
.
.

love,
sarapeating Wink Laughing

Wanna buy an egg?
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sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 903
Location: below sea level

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a movie we can see:

Taglines for
"Déjà Vu":

"Your life seems perfect...

Your future is set...

Then you meet the love of your life." Exclamation


love,
sarafan
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fox



Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 821
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sara!

Some serious words here...:

Are you in a romantic mood?
Embarassed


Idea the most undercover, secret-movie: fox-y
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sara



Joined: 21 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Laughing

Why you clever little fox! Shocked

You've got 'me' blushing! Embarassed

But, hey.....that's 'my role' on this 'dek! Twisted Evil


So......you gonna tell me the secrets?

love,
sarateasing
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awakening
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Joined: 12 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nemo wrote:

I'm just funning with you.


I was just getting ready for a serious non dual response... and now you tell me that you are just funning?

Oh well, as G.K. Chesterton said;

"The angels fly because they take them selves lightly". Very Happy

PS

The chair just tried to bite me.

Sara. 'No-Thing' matters and that is All that matters.
Fox knows this.
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