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dilaram
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:47 am    Post subject: Enlightenment Reply with quote

Enlightenment cannot be known...although, seemingly it can...
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toombaru



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 3:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Enlightenment Reply with quote

dilaram wrote:
Enlightenment cannot be known...although, seemingly it can...




There is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.
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Blossom



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


May I say this, Heart to Heart, Beloved Life:

"Here" is a place of total peace (sounds right to me) But "no one lives there" (sounds really not true at all) First of all "there" is included within Here. And further more, we all Live Here, inclusive of 'there' As This Awareness ---There is no Other Awareness Here. I Am That, This is You, We are Being It ( if we accept the Greater One We Be)


“Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.”

Total Peace is the very essence of who you are, who we are, who I am— Unchanging, Perfection, Harmony, and Divine Intelligence, this is who we are. Real Peace is beyond the everyday changing ideas of peace.

Why insist that there is not a Self (or self) when in fact Identity is all that is, this Awareness, and Identity is Divine and It is not limited to form, it includes all form, all ‘things’---

God’s Awareness is this very Awareness right here and now and This is My Identity, and there is only One Identity Here.

To try to deny that you exist is a sin---To say there is no God is a sin, to put yourself up as something 'mechanical' or less (or more ) than The All That God Is, is a sin--- This Life is The Very Presence of God’s Self-Awareness and It is The One and Only Being that YOU are---There is no other --- This That I Am (you are) is The Living Light of All that Is, and we are made in God’s Image and Likeness, God and our Identity, closer than fingers and toes--Eternal, Everlasting, All encompassing Life Itself, and I am That.


You and I live as the Awareness that Is Here and Now and undeniable. To say this Awareness cannot be seen, felt, understood, lived, by us, is really a sin (sin means to miss the mark).

To say that no one lives where Peace is, is really a blatant lie---Peace is the Light and Life of everything and everyone---We are That right now, we feel and Be Its Presence right Now---Peace is not an unattainable 'thing' ‘out there’ -- It is all there to that which is Real and This Peace that Is Here Being this Living Presence of God-Ineffable All in all.

Divine Mind, unlimited Mind, unbound Consciousness is Who And What We Are--- to constantly ‘preach other wise’ is disgraceful.

The Peace I see is within Me, It belongs To Me, This Awareness I Am is my direct interface with the Eternal Light that is being All That I Am ( and you are) and there is no other awareness here, and nothing Real can ever be less than This Living Peace we Be--- Being and Seeing are One. Take up the Real Identity, let go the insistence that there is 'another one besides' ---I am (you are) This Seeing and Being of God’s Grace, right now, right as you read. All you need to do is accept the Allness of God and then simply live It as your Real Self. Watch and see the marvels of His Grace in your life.

The entire scene is contained within conscious awareness, The scene is conscious awareness in action. I see the tree and sky, the dancing clouds, and swaying grass, and scampering squirrel; they are not ‘out there’ not separate from this awareness that I am. All things are within God’s Ever Constant Presence, Omnipresent Being, which includes the all encompassing Peace that God Is right now and already, just as It is-

It is best to understand that the Identity-I-am is the awareness within which ‘we see’ the old tree and the little squirrel play together---One Awareness, all is within This Light, this Infinite, All Knowing Light is Who ‘we’ are.

Peace is my Identity; Awareness (Life, life) is the I-that-I- Am and the ‘old man’ who claims, and stands by a lie saying that its life is contained, bound, restricted, and enslaved by its own brain, a small mind, and its thinking, is like someone still telling us the earth is flat and wanting us to accept that as true.

I do not know what purpose this serves other than to get folks like me, who would not ordinarily speak up, to shout the Truth from the roof tops. You just make me more fearless. I say that it is wrong to hold others from Seeing The Truth of their Real Identity, and to try to perpetuate the lie and liar.

Just in case some are buying the lies; the angels have volunteered me to this little job, here today.

All images (forms) that exist within this awareness, this awareness right here reading the words and writing them. Awareness (or awareness) I am (you are)— our Identity is not the body form that goes by “my” name or "yours"; that form is merely the point in time and space from which Awareness perceives tangibles. That point Belongs to God as an aspect of God's Awareness.

Get this clear, the whole of Identity is not the body-form---All thoughts and ideas, thinking, words, labels, symbols, stuff and things are the qualities and attributes of God---there is no other. Thinking is a good thing when we understand our Ungovernable Real Self, and Live It---Thinking is a Divine Attribute of God, and we are not supposed to be 'not be thinking'. Thinking is not a cage or trap. Thinking is Wonderful, thinking is part of Awareness---

Yikes, don't try to get rid of thinking or thinkers, instead find the joy in the Beauty and Flow of God's Infinite Mind.

Think about the Allness of God and see what happens. Yes, Think.

No ‘man’ is "out side" of Awareness therefore no human has any authority over others. Remember that the one who appears to be doing the looking from a point in space, is an aspect of God’s Being as a witness of God's Self Knowing.

I am Awareness, not limited to a body or a brain, and certainly not subject to or enslaved by my thoughts---powerless thoughts arising within the Awareness that is God's Totality of Self ---You see that, and then the thoughts become happy, peaceful, joyous, helpful, creative, unique, marvelous, insightful, intelligent thoughts.

The Only Power Here is This Divine Consciousness, and this Mind and Its Awareness. This Real and Living Truth That Is, cannot be altered, hindered, changed, ended, conned, duped, confused or made into anything It is not.

The JOY of thinking; thinking is a delightful aspect of God---We are Free from Fear Here, and Now, we ARE Peace, here and now, pick up your scepter and Live!

My Father and I are one, but my Father is greater than I, He doeth the works. I bear witness to that which the Father has show me”

Isaiah 52:7
How beautiful on the mountains
are the feet of those who bring good news,
who proclaim peace,
who bring good tidings,
who proclaim salvation,
who say to Zion,
"Your God reigns!"

Hallelujah, and that's my Sunday morning gig, In God's name--Blessed Be.


Blossom-Sweetpea-Sandy-Joy
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What is bound on earth is bound in heaven and what is freed on earth is freed in heaven.


Last edited by Blossom on Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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toombaru



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “here is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may be just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


May I say this, Heart to Heart, Beloved Life:

"Here" is a place of total peace (sounds right to me) But "no one lives there" (sounds really not true at all) First of all "there" is included within Here. And further more, we all Live Here, inclusive of 'there' As This Awareness ---There is no Other Awareness Here. I Am That, This is You, We are Being It ( if we accept the Greater One We Be)


“Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.”

Total Peace is the very essence of who you are, who we are, who I am— Unchanging, Perfection, Harmony, and Divine Intelligence, this is who we are.

Why insist that there is not Self (or self) when in fact Identity is all that is, this Awareness, and Identity is Divine and It is not limited to form, it includes all form, all ‘things’---

God’s Awareness is this very Awareness right here and now and This is My Identity, and there is only One Identity Here.

To try to deny that you exist is a sin---To say there is no God is a sin, to put yourself up as something 'mechanical' or less (or more ) than The All That God Is, is a sin--- This Life is The Very Presence of God’s Self-Awareness and It is The One and Only Being that YOU are---There is no other --- This That I Am (you are) is The Living Light of All that Is, and we are made in God’s Image and Likeness, God and our Identity, closer than fingers and toes--Eternal, Everlasting, All encompassing Life Itself, and I am That.


You and I live as the Awareness that Is Here and Now and undeniable. To say this Awareness cannot be seen, felt, understood, lived, by us, is really a sin (sin means to miss the mark).

To say that no one lives where Peace is, is really a blatant lie---Peace is the Light and Life of everything and everyone---We are That right now, we feel Its Presence right Now---Peace is not an unattainable 'thing' ‘out there’ -- It is all there to that which is Real and This Peace that Is Here Being this Living Presence of God-Ineffable All in all.

Divine Mind, unlimited Mind, unbound Consciousness is Who And What We Are--- to constantly ‘preach other wise’ is disgraceful.

The Peace I see is within Me, It belongs To Me, This Awareness I Am is my direct interface with the Eternal Light that is being All That I Am ( and you are) and there is no other awareness here, and nothing Real is less than This Living Peace we Be--- Being and Seeing are One. Take up the Real Identity, let go the insistence that there is 'an other one besides' ---I am (you are) This Seeing and Being of God’s Grace, right now, right as you read. All you need to do is accept the Allness of God and then simply live It as your Real Self. Watch and see the marvels of His Grace in your life.

The entire scene is contained within conscious awareness, The scene is conscious awareness in action. I see the tree and sky, the dancing clouds, and swaying grass, and scampering squirrel; they not ‘out there’ not separate from this awareness that I am. All things are within God’s Ever Constant Presence, Omnipresent Being, which includes the all encompassing Peace that God Is right now and already, just as It is-

It is best to understand that the Identity-I-am is the awareness within which ‘we see’ the old tree and the little squirrel play together---One Awareness, all is within This Light, this Infinite, All Knowing Light is Who ‘we’ are.

Peace is my Identity; Awareness (Life, life) is the I-that-I- Am and the ‘old man’ who claims, and stands by a lie saying that its life is contained, bound, restricted, and enslaved by its own brain, a small mind, and its thinking, is like someone still telling us the earth is flat and wanting us to accept that as true.

I do not know what purpose this serves other than to get folks like me, who would not ordinarily speak up, to shout the Truth from roof tops. You just make me more fearless. I say that it is wrong to hold others from Seeing The Truth of their Real Identity, and to try to perpetuate the lie and liar.

Just in case some are buying the lies; the angels have volunteered me to this little job.

All images (forms) that exist within this awareness, this awareness right here reading the words and writing them. Awareness (or awareness) I am (you are)— our Identity is not the body form that goes by “my” name or "yours"; that form is merely the point in time and space from which Awareness perceives tangibles. That point Belongs to God as an aspect of God's Awareness.

Get this clear, the whole of Identity is not the body-form---All thoughts and ideas, thinking, words, labels, symbols, stuff and things are the qualities and attributes of God---there is no other. Thinking is a good thing when we understand our Ungovernable Real Self, and Live It---Thinking is Divine Attribute of God, and we are not supposed to be 'not thinking'. Thinking is not a cage or trap. Thinking is Wonderful, thinking is part of Awareness---Yikes, you don't try to get rid of thinking or thinkers.

Think about the Allness of God and see what happens.

No ‘man’ is "out side" of Awareness therefore no human has any authority over others. Remember that the one who appears to be doing the looking from a point in space, is an aspect of God’s Being as a witness of God's Self Knowing.

I am Awareness, not limited to a body or a brain, and certainly not subject to or enslaved by my thoughts---powerless thoughts arising within God's Totality of Self ---You see that, and then the thoughts become happy, peaceful, joyous, helpful, creative, unique, marvelous, insightful, intelligent thoughts.

The Only Power Here is This Divine Consciousness, and this Mind and Its Awareness. This Real That Is, cannot be alerted, hindered, changed, ended, or made into anything It is not.

The JOY of thinking, thinking is a delightful aspect of God---We are Free from Fear Here, and Now, we ARE Peace, here and now, pick up your scepter and Live!

My Father and I are one, but my Father is greater than I, He doeth the works. I bear witness to that which the Father has show me”

Isaiah 52:7
How beautiful on the mountains
are the feet of those who bring good news,
who proclaim peace,
who bring good tidings,
who proclaim salvation,
who say to Zion,
"Your God reigns!"

Hallelujah, and that's my Sunday morning gig, In God's name--Blessed Be.


Blossom-Sweetpea-Sandy-Joy


If you quote the Big Book.....read it all the way through.

Cruelty and violence in the Bible:

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/cruelty/long.html
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Blossom



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Location: Ojai, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something from my friend William Samuel:

"What has happened for some of us individually is soon to happen for all mankind. There are two views we mortals contain-the individual view and the quantum overview; the man-with-a-name's view and the holistic view. From the standpoint of a View I have been blessed to live, I see clear indication that a new world clock has been turned on in the Species-in Quantum Man, exactly as God turned it on in what appears the individual "me" forty years ago. Just as the century plant makes a final flowering at the end of its span, so the Tree of Life-appearing as humanity-is soon to begin a strange behavior from an unrelenting inner urge that will result, after much internal and external turmoil without precedent, in a New Bloom, a New Community. This divine stirring, different from all that has gone before in this pulse of events for eleven thousand years, will bring mankind to re-examine his values; rethink his ideas and beliefs; retest his religions and philosophies, his governments and systems, and find them woefully inadequate; thence to turn within himself into a subjective view of Life, to discover the very Essence of Self-within-the Child of God.

These events, already begun, will become quantum-every man alive feeling and responding, flailing positively or negatively, responding in all ways, unable to find respite in the former things."

From a very important book written for these New Days we are in;

The Child Within Us Lives! By William Samuel
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toombaru



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blossom wrote:
Something from my friend William Samuel:

"What has happened for some of us individually is soon to happen for all mankind. There are two views we mortals contain-the individual view and the quantum overview; the man-with-a-name's view and the holistic view. From the standpoint of a View I have been blessed to live, I see clear indication that a new world clock has been turned on in the Species-in Quantum Man, exactly as God turned it on in what appears the individual "me" forty years ago. Just as the century plant makes a final flowering at the end of its span, so the Tree of Life-appearing as humanity-is soon to begin a strange behavior from an unrelenting inner urge that will result, after much internal and external turmoil without precedent, in a New Bloom, a New Community. This divine stirring, different from all that has gone before in this pulse of events for eleven thousand years, will bring mankind to re-examine his values; rethink his ideas and beliefs; retest his religions and philosophies, his governments and systems, and find them woefully inadequate; thence to turn within himself into a subjective view of Life, to discover the very Essence of Self-within-the Child of God.

These events, already begun, will become quantum-every man alive feeling and responding, flailing positively or negatively, responding in all ways, unable to find respite in the former things."

From a very important book written for these New Days we are in;

The Child Within Us Lives! By William Samuel



The psyche of man is predisposed to believe that living in its dream are individuals who can foresee the future.

There is no evidence to support that belief.

For the last two thousand years every generation has prepared for the cataclysmic end of the world.

Every generation believes that they will be the last.

The origin of such beliefs are based only on the innate fear of physical death that the conceptual entity lives with and not on any person's ability to see into the future.
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Xmac



Joined: 18 Apr 2010
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Location: Boston area, Massachusetts

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.
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empty-and-full



Joined: 23 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,

to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?
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toombaru



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,
















(t)
The negation of a delusional stance is not delusional.















to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?






"What Is" for the sense of I am is a pseudo reality composed solely of self-referential thought patterns.
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Xmac



Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 200
Location: Boston area, Massachusetts

PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,

to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?


Yes, and.....
Thoughts are what is.
Attempts to hold a position are what is.

Taking it seriously is what is.
I just don't take it seriously.

It's all good fun though, the supernatural gas gas gas!
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empty-and-full



Joined: 23 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Xmac wrote:
empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,

to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?


Yes, and.....
Thoughts are what is.
Attempts to hold a position are what is.

Taking it seriously is what is.
I just don't take it seriously.

It's all good fun though, the supernatural gas gas gas!


you say it's all good fun xmac but is it?

isn't our taking our thoughts, our judgements seriously the very root of all our suffering?

i'm not talking about you guys in particular,

i'm talking about almost everyone on the planet

we seem to know so much, we are interpreting and judging all the time

what about an innocent mind?

one that is free from the need to hold any position whatsoever

one that is free from the need to know, to judge,

hasn't it had it's most heaviest burden lifted?
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Xmac



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you say it's all good fun xmac but is it?

Fun or enjoyment can fade quickly when there is all eternity within which to have it. So what to do? Well hiding or concealing the experience of Lila is a cosmic hoot! Ignorance is really ignore-ance.

I find it so amazing that one can find wisdom in the most outrageous places, like pop culture catch phrases that are meant to be comedic: "are we having fun yet?" and "it's all good".

Now that said, if one is stuck deep in the dream and apparently suffering, it is a reality that is unmovable to the experiencer and I respect that perception.


isn't our taking our thoughts, our judgements seriously the very root of all our suffering?

Taking our thoughts seriously is what we do sometimes or all the time, apparently.
That's what is.

Thinking that one shouldn't take their thoughts seriously when they do and that there shouldn't be any suffering is suffering.


i'm not talking about you guys in particular,

i'm talking about almost everyone on the planet

I don't know what their experience is even if they tell me.
I know I don't know because I have spoken what I thought was my truth
and it turned out that I was not in touch with it. I'm not saying they aren't suffering. For me, they are a mirror of my own suffering so that's job one: my suffering.


we seem to know so much, we are interpreting and judging all the time

what about an innocent mind?

one that is free from the need to hold any position whatsoever

one that is free from the need to know, to judge,

All minds are free. They don't want it...yet. Their not done pretending. So it seems.

hasn't it had it's most heaviest burden lifted?[/quote]

The burden is the cosmic joke, the story, the slight of hand.
Shhh, you'll spoil the surprise.

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toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="empty-and-full"][quote="Xmac"]
empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,

to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?


Yes, and.....
Thoughts are what is.
Attempts to hold a position are what is.




(t)
People don't have or hold positions.
People ARE positions.
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toombaru



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
empty-and-full wrote:
Xmac wrote:
Blossom wrote:
Toombaru says “there is a place of total peace.......but no one lives there.”


Sorry, I may just not be understanding any of Toombarus pronouncements---but, they seem way off target.

and besides that, enlightenment can certainly be Known, you know when you 'get it' and when you don't. You know.


Now, if I am just reading some of this all wrong, then I bet many others are too.


Maybe, but just read it a little more closely. He's right.


is he right?

or is he left?

seriously, anything said about something called enlightenment is really just another thought,

another attempt to hold a point of view,

to have a position

but enlightenment isn't really about that is it?

isn't it about just being what is?


Yes, and.....
Thoughts are what is.
Attempts to hold a position are what is.

Taking it seriously is what is.
I just don't take it seriously.

It's all good fun though, the supernatural gas gas gas!


you say it's all good fun xmac but is it?

isn't our taking our thoughts, our judgements seriously the very root of all our suffering?

i'm not talking about you guys in particular,

i'm talking about almost everyone on the planet

we seem to know so much, we are interpreting and judging all the time

what about an innocent mind?

one that is free from the need to hold any position whatsoever

one that is free from the need to know, to judge,

hasn't it had it's most heaviest burden lifted?





In the sense that darkness is lifted when the sun comes up.
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Xmac



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Posts: 200
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

toombaru wrote:


(t)
People don't have or hold positions.

Yes, however I regard that as a given.

People ARE positions.


What does that mean? They stay the same? They are located somewhere? In what sense?
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