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Meaning and Perception

 
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michael



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Posts: 3816
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:21 am    Post subject: Meaning and Perception Reply with quote

The world as it is known is not as it appears.

In itself, the world is known to be fixed in size with all fixed objects having defined shapes and location relative to each other.

The world as it is perceived is not like this.

Objects perceived to be 'in the distance' are small and every object appears to move relative to other objects as the viewpoint changes, changing size and shape in the process.

That which changes cannot be like that which does not change.

Yet that which does not change gives meaning to the changing shapes.

A car seen from the rear looks nothing like the same car seen side on, yet it is seen to be the same car.

This is possible only because the whole car is known. This 'knowing' is associated with both 'views', giving meaning to them. In one case, it is named the 'back view', in the other it is named the 'side view'.

In itself, the car is not like either view, it is an object that cannot be visualised or experienced 'all at once'. Whatever is visualised or seen is a 2-D projection, not the object as it is 'in itself'. What is true of the 'car' is true of all objects, including all 'people'... including'me'... (every 'me) Shocked .

The world and all objects are thought of as 'extending in time and space'. They do not. As a dream they have no reality. They exist in no place and no time.

All objects 'exist' only as conceptions within the knowing which is one with Consciousness.

'What' is the nature of 'Knowing'... no idea Very Happy

Knowing is the source of ideas/knowing/meaning/conception... which are not like 'human thoughts' (which are mere commentary or imaginings). These 'conceptions' are the 'thing itself'... on every 'level' from 'micro' to 'macro' and everything in between, including all 'inter-relations' with every other object... all things as one.

The Knowing knows all that is to be known. When it comes to 'concepts', there are none it does not know. Surprised

Yet, it cannot be conceived of, for it is the source of conception.

As the Unknowable, Knowing is known.

Love
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cimages



Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 669

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

How is it.....that 'you'......little c.....Have come to know this.

This can't be considered from 'your' perspective.

Because 'you' are the perspective. So properly written it would be perspective you.

Same as with perspective 'me'. This is the only thing that 'I' can know. But 'I' can't even know that because 'I' am simply the perspective. Being expressed as perspective 'me'.

This me has no substance in & of itself! No-thing that it can define. Perspective 'me' or Perspective 'you' is the definition....but only of that perspective.

If 'I' was a radical Islamist extremist.....This...would be the only thing that 'I' know from this perspective.....This 'I' thinks & functions from this perspective (or think, that I think......I think?). So I blow myself up....There is no more this perspective & never was but yet, this perspective persists.

What does perspective mean anyway....who or what or where has meaning been applied to this expression? The same source that has defined this 'you'.

Perspective only knows it's meaning as defined by it's source...if, within it's definition...it...perspective is the source...then from perspective's perspective it is....but it only thinks that because THAT is the definition as applied by the source....but from perspective's perspective...'IT'...can't possibly know that because it is defined only as perspective & not the source doing the defining.

Got to go...EMERGENCY...To the Batcave Robin!

Peace! Cool..Just be Cool!..signed..The Batman...formally known as little c.
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toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 5189
Location: There are no locations

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cimages wrote:
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

How is it.....that 'you'......little c.....Have come to know this.

This can't be considered from 'your' perspective.

Because 'you' are the perspective. So properly written it would be perspective you.

Same as with perspective 'me'. This is the only thing that 'I' can know. But 'I' can't even know that because 'I' am simply the perspective. Being expressed as perspective 'me'.

This me has no substance in & of itself! No-thing that it can define. Perspective 'me' or Perspective 'you' is the definition....but only of that perspective.

If 'I' was a radical Islamist extremist.....This...would be the only thing that 'I' know from this perspective.....This 'I' thinks & functions from this perspective (or think, that I think......I think?). So I blow myself up....There is no more this perspective & never was but yet, this perspective persists.

What does perspective mean anyway....who or what or where has meaning been applied to this expression? The same source that has defined this 'you'.

Perspective only knows it's meaning as defined by it's source...if, within it's definition...it...perspective is the source...then from perspective's perspective it is....but it only thinks that because THAT is the definition as applied by the source....but from perspective's perspective...'IT'...can't possibly know that because it is defined only as perspective & not the source doing the defining.

Got to go...EMERGENCY...To the Batcave Robin!

Peace! 8)..Just be Cool!..signed..The Batman...formally known as little c.





Nothing can see itself.


toombaru
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cimages



Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 669

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

toombaru wrote:


Nothing can see itself.

toombaru


How would this nothing know this?

It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.

Peace! Cool ...Just be Cool!...signed nothing.... formally known as little c
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toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 5189
Location: There are no locations

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cimages wrote:
toombaru wrote:


Nothing can see itself.

toombaru


How would this nothing know this?


toombaru: There is knowing.


"It" can "know" nothing.



It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.


The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.


toombaru









Peace! 8) ...Just be Cool!...signed nothing.... formally known as little c
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wizdumb



Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Posts: 132

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:24 pm    Post subject: SATSANG Reply with quote

What is TRUTH ?.......... but, a perception of what we BE lieve !
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toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 5189
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:05 pm    Post subject: Re: SATSANG Reply with quote

wizdumb wrote:
What is TRUTH ?.......... but, a perception of what we BE lieve !




In nature.............there is no truth.



toombaru
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cimages



Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 669

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cimages wrote:

It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.


toombaru wrote:

The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.


The answer...... is.......within the question!

If there is only the question....from where does the question arise?

It arises from that which can not be known!

In Knowing this lies the freedom to just be what you are at this moment!

Real or imagined, an expression of consciousness or consciousness itself.

The question arises, you arise, the answer is within you. But there is no you......And yet the question still remains.....And STILL there is this apparent you.

What else is there to know?.....what else can be Known?

Nothing!..........Everything else is just......Static!


Peace!
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wizdumb



Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Posts: 132

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:44 pm    Post subject: DIVINITY Reply with quote

To thine own SELF be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.
William Shakespeare


Quote:
toombaru writes:
In nature.............there is no truth.
................

The difference between a weed and a flower is "perception" ! DWD
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toombaru



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 5189
Location: There are no locations

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cimages wrote:
cimages wrote:

It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.


toombaru wrote:

The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.


The answer...... is.......within the question!

If there is only the question....from where does the question arise?

It arises from that which can not be known!

In Knowing this lies the freedom to just be what you are at this moment!

Real or imagined, an expression of consciousness or consciousness itself.

The question arises, you arise, the answer is within you. But there is no you......And yet the question still remains.....And STILL there is this apparent you.

What else is there to know?.....what else can be Known?

Nothing!..........Everything else is just......Static!


Peace!





Who? What? Where? When? Why?.............All questions relate to the illusory self.

Factor out that........and the questions evaporate.


toombaru
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cimages



Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 669

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:07 pm    Post subject: Re: DIVINITY Reply with quote

wizdumb wrote:
To thine own SELF be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.
William Shakespeare


Quote:
toombaru writes:
In nature.............there is no truth.
................

The difference between a weed and a flower is "perception" ! DWD


What "perception" is being referred to?

Every-thing is just as true as un-true.

That which defines this "perception" defines that "perception".

Perception is not something to posses it is that which does the possesing.

From one perception the statement is true from another it's false.

That........which is deciding.......is the answer!

Peace! Cool
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wizdumb



Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Posts: 132

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:26 pm    Post subject: simultanious interdependent coarising Reply with quote

This forum is very enlightening.


THE WITNESSER/OR

Thank you, leo, and all.

I AM, like the ant trying to lug out the grain that's way too big. Rumi.

Thanks !
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