Meaning and Perception

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michael
Posts: 3816
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2003 12:13 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Meaning and Perception

Post by michael » Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:21 am

The world as it is known is not as it appears.

In itself, the world is known to be fixed in size with all fixed objects having defined shapes and location relative to each other.

The world as it is perceived is not like this.

Objects perceived to be 'in the distance' are small and every object appears to move relative to other objects as the viewpoint changes, changing size and shape in the process.

That which changes cannot be like that which does not change.

Yet that which does not change gives meaning to the changing shapes.

A car seen from the rear looks nothing like the same car seen side on, yet it is seen to be the same car.

This is possible only because the whole car is known. This 'knowing' is associated with both 'views', giving meaning to them. In one case, it is named the 'back view', in the other it is named the 'side view'.

In itself, the car is not like either view, it is an object that cannot be visualised or experienced 'all at once'. Whatever is visualised or seen is a 2-D projection, not the object as it is 'in itself'. What is true of the 'car' is true of all objects, including all 'people'... including'me'... (every 'me) :shock: .

The world and all objects are thought of as 'extending in time and space'. They do not. As a dream they have no reality. They exist in no place and no time.

All objects 'exist' only as conceptions within the knowing which is one with Consciousness.

'What' is the nature of 'Knowing'... no idea :D

Knowing is the source of ideas/knowing/meaning/conception... which are not like 'human thoughts' (which are mere commentary or imaginings). These 'conceptions' are the 'thing itself'... on every 'level' from 'micro' to 'macro' and everything in between, including all 'inter-relations' with every other object... all things as one.

The Knowing knows all that is to be known. When it comes to 'concepts', there are none it does not know. :o

Yet, it cannot be conceived of, for it is the source of conception.

As the Unknowable, Knowing is known.

Love
From Source to Source: an Endless Spring
cimages
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Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:14 am

Post by cimages » Tue Nov 22, 2005 3:15 pm

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

How is it.....that 'you'......little c.....Have come to know this.

This can't be considered from 'your' perspective.

Because 'you' are the perspective. So properly written it would be perspective you.

Same as with perspective 'me'. This is the only thing that 'I' can know. But 'I' can't even know that because 'I' am simply the perspective. Being expressed as perspective 'me'.

This me has no substance in & of itself! No-thing that it can define. Perspective 'me' or Perspective 'you' is the definition....but only of that perspective.

If 'I' was a radical Islamist extremist.....This...would be the only thing that 'I' know from this perspective.....This 'I' thinks & functions from this perspective (or think, that I think......I think?). So I blow myself up....There is no more this perspective & never was but yet, this perspective persists.

What does perspective mean anyway....who or what or where has meaning been applied to this expression? The same source that has defined this 'you'.

Perspective only knows it's meaning as defined by it's source...if, within it's definition...it...perspective is the source...then from perspective's perspective it is....but it only thinks that because THAT is the definition as applied by the source....but from perspective's perspective...'IT'...can't possibly know that because it is defined only as perspective & not the source doing the defining.

Got to go...EMERGENCY...To the Batcave Robin!

Peace! 8)..Just be Cool!..signed..The Batman...formally known as little c.
toombaru
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Post by toombaru » Tue Nov 22, 2005 3:32 pm

cimages wrote:Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

How is it.....that 'you'......little c.....Have come to know this.

This can't be considered from 'your' perspective.

Because 'you' are the perspective. So properly written it would be perspective you.

Same as with perspective 'me'. This is the only thing that 'I' can know. But 'I' can't even know that because 'I' am simply the perspective. Being expressed as perspective 'me'.

This me has no substance in & of itself! No-thing that it can define. Perspective 'me' or Perspective 'you' is the definition....but only of that perspective.

If 'I' was a radical Islamist extremist.....This...would be the only thing that 'I' know from this perspective.....This 'I' thinks & functions from this perspective (or think, that I think......I think?). So I blow myself up....There is no more this perspective & never was but yet, this perspective persists.

What does perspective mean anyway....who or what or where has meaning been applied to this expression? The same source that has defined this 'you'.

Perspective only knows it's meaning as defined by it's source...if, within it's definition...it...perspective is the source...then from perspective's perspective it is....but it only thinks that because THAT is the definition as applied by the source....but from perspective's perspective...'IT'...can't possibly know that because it is defined only as perspective & not the source doing the defining.

Got to go...EMERGENCY...To the Batcave Robin!

Peace! 8)..Just be Cool!..signed..The Batman...formally known as little c.



Nothing can see itself.


toombaru
cimages
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Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:14 am

Post by cimages » Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:16 pm

toombaru wrote:
Nothing can see itself.

toombaru
How would this nothing know this?

It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.

Peace! 8) ...Just be Cool!...signed nothing.... formally known as little c
toombaru
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Post by toombaru » Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:31 pm

cimages wrote:
toombaru wrote:
Nothing can see itself.

toombaru
How would this nothing know this?


toombaru: There is knowing.


"It" can "know" nothing.



It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.


The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.


toombaru









Peace! 8) ...Just be Cool!...signed nothing.... formally known as little c
wizdumb
Posts: 132
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SATSANG

Post by wizdumb » Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:24 pm

What is TRUTH ?.......... but, a perception of what we BE lieve !
toombaru
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Re: SATSANG

Post by toombaru » Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:05 pm

wizdumb wrote:What is TRUTH ?.......... but, a perception of what we BE lieve !


In nature.............there is no truth.



toombaru
cimages
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Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:14 am

Post by cimages » Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:35 pm

cimages wrote: It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.
toombaru wrote: The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.
The answer...... is.......within the question!

If there is only the question....from where does the question arise?

It arises from that which can not be known!

In Knowing this lies the freedom to just be what you are at this moment!

Real or imagined, an expression of consciousness or consciousness itself.

The question arises, you arise, the answer is within you. But there is no you......And yet the question still remains.....And STILL there is this apparent you.

What else is there to know?.....what else can be Known?

Nothing!..........Everything else is just......Static!


Peace!
wizdumb
Posts: 132
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:58 pm

DIVINITY

Post by wizdumb » Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:44 pm

To thine own SELF be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.
William Shakespeare

toombaru writes:
In nature.............there is no truth.
................

The difference between a weed and a flower is "perception" ! DWD
toombaru
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Post by toombaru » Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:03 pm

cimages wrote:
cimages wrote: It is not I that asks the question, there is only.... the question.
toombaru wrote: The question contains the answer..........Together...... they cease to exist.
The answer...... is.......within the question!

If there is only the question....from where does the question arise?

It arises from that which can not be known!

In Knowing this lies the freedom to just be what you are at this moment!

Real or imagined, an expression of consciousness or consciousness itself.

The question arises, you arise, the answer is within you. But there is no you......And yet the question still remains.....And STILL there is this apparent you.

What else is there to know?.....what else can be Known?

Nothing!..........Everything else is just......Static!


Peace!



Who? What? Where? When? Why?.............All questions relate to the illusory self.

Factor out that........and the questions evaporate.


toombaru
cimages
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Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:14 am

Re: DIVINITY

Post by cimages » Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:07 pm

wizdumb wrote:To thine own SELF be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.
William Shakespeare

toombaru writes:
In nature.............there is no truth.
................

The difference between a weed and a flower is "perception" ! DWD
What "perception" is being referred to?

Every-thing is just as true as un-true.

That which defines this "perception" defines that "perception".

Perception is not something to posses it is that which does the possesing.

From one perception the statement is true from another it's false.

That........which is deciding.......is the answer!

Peace! 8)
wizdumb
Posts: 132
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:58 pm

simultanious interdependent coarising

Post by wizdumb » Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:26 pm

This forum is very enlightening.


THE WITNESSER/OR

Thank you, leo, and all.

I AM, like the ant trying to lug out the grain that's way too big. Rumi.

Thanks !
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